Joe the Plumber Speaks ... to the Radical Right

By TChris, Section Elections 2008
Posted on Wed Oct 15, 2008 at 10:57:56 PM EST
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This post on the Wall Street Journal's Washington Wire links to a spooky right wing website that purports to have an interview with Joe the Plumber. If it's accurate, Joe is frightened by the socialist tendencies of Barack Obama's healthcare and tax policies.

Warning: The site's mission is "to empower all Americans to become proactive defenders of our national security and community safety." The site is pro-Patriot Act, believes Homeland Security starts at the borders, and urges greater awareness and fear of the threat we face from terrorists working to "establish Islam as the dominant force worldwide by undermining the Western institutions that restrict the ascendancy of radical Islam." Take the source for what it's worth, even if it was good enough for Washington Wire.

And then ask whether Joe the Plumber (who asked his question hypothetically because he hasn't actually started his own plumbing shop and isn't making $250K but might some day) was worth talking about tonight.

< Is It Over For John McCain? | "Joe the Plumber" Compares Obama to Sammy Davis, Jr. >

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Joe the Plumber Speaks ... to the Radical Right | 13 comments (13 topical)

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Ridiculous (5.00 / 0) (#1)
by cal1942 on Wed Oct 15, 2008 at 11:13:52 PM EST

but not surprising that so much attention is given someone who probably doesn't know jack about government and probably couldn't pass Civics 101.

Before the debate, he was already booked (5.00 / 1) (#3)
by Teresa on Wed Oct 15, 2008 at 11:16:14 PM EST

on Huckabee's show for this weekend. When CNN went to the replay, I switched over to see what Fox was saying and I saw him say that.

The Joe the Plumber scenario seemed so contrived. (5.00 / 1) (#4)
by DeborahNC on Wed Oct 15, 2008 at 11:27:25 PM EST

Now I know why. It was a hypothetical situation for "Joe." McCain used Joe to make a point, which he thought would resonate with the public. It just did not sound authentic to me.

McCain has tried multiple approaches in his efforts to become president, but none of them have worked because McCain doesn't seem genuine when he attempts to connect with average voters.

The CNN focus group didn't like Joe the Plumber stories either. Only one person in the entire group appreciated the message. That small percentage probably reflects the number of people in the country who will end up voting for him.

He's his own worst enemy.

How silly (5.00 / 1) (#11)
by Dave B on Thu Oct 16, 2008 at 08:09:19 AM EST

The Republicans try to imply that the tax increase on people making above $250k would remove any incentive for small businesses invest in growing their companies.

WTF?

Obama told Joe the Plumber that his marginal rate for income "profit" over $250k would increase from 35% to 39%. A 4% increase. So say he grows his profit by $100k. His tax bill on that $100k is $39k instead of $35k. So his take home would increase by $65k instead of $69k.

Riiiiight. It just wouldn't be worth it... Joe just would have no incentive to increase his take home by that measly $65k.

Count Floyd is... not really scared at all (none / 0) (#2)
by LonewackoDotCom on Wed Oct 15, 2008 at 11:16:13 PM EST

Whether JTP makes that much now or not is immaterial: there are plenty of others in the situation he described. And, of course, the site where he gave an interview is immaterial as well. And, of course, those are distractions from what Obama said before, which is definitely a bit further than necessary redistribution in order to pay for infrastructure and the like but is more indicative of him trying to arrange equality of outcome. When you do the latter, well, guess what that's called.

And, since I'm sure TChris is a strong proponent of the First Amendment I'm sure he isn't opposed to regular citizens calling politicians on the flaws in their policies.

: Sorry (5.00 / 3) (#5)
by cal1942 on Thu Oct 16, 2008 at 12:15:44 AM EST

lonewackodotcom. Joe the Plumber was a plant.
Interesting that there happen to be photos of Joe at rallies made available to the network. Interesting that McCain leads with Joe. McCain keeps going on about 'Obama's eloquence' and then Joe says that Obama has a real tap dance. And you might want to explain why Joe was booked to appear on Huckabee's show BEFORE tonight's debate.
More than a bit much.
Now it's quite obvious that you get out of bed on the far right side. Your statements about progressive taxation are a dead giveaway.
Do yourself a favor and cash it in, the people who comment on this site are batting in a league above and beyond your capability.

McCain focused on Joe the Fictitional Plumber (none / 0) (#6)
by thereyougo on Thu Oct 16, 2008 at 12:35:04 AM EST

in a hypothetical. Its absurd in its face.

Yeah I saw Obama talk to him, but now that he popped up all over the place, I see this was fabricated, and contrived to make nonsense out of Obama's plan to ( falsely) raise his taxes and the dude isn't EVEN in business!

Insane!

lonewackodotcom, (none / 0) (#7)
by cpinva on Thu Oct 16, 2008 at 12:38:58 AM EST

very apt nic.

you conveniently overlook the fact that our system of federal income tax has been progressive since the 16th amendment was initialy ratified; the more you make, the higher your rate. nothing particularly new or unique there.

it has little to do with "redistributing" income, and all about paying for the nation's expenses.

Read what Obama said (none / 0) (#8)
by LonewackoDotCom on Thu Oct 16, 2008 at 12:54:05 AM EST

I'm pretty sure you've used that simple-minded ad hom about my nick before, or at least many others have.
What Obama said went far beyond simply paying expenses. He said: "When you spread the wealth around, it's good for everybody". That's a socialistic notion, whether you want to admit it or not. And, why not admit it? Socialism is a perfectly valid political belief.

Note that Obama didn't say, "we need the money to pay for roads and defense", he supported redistribution for its own sake.


: Just so you know (5.00 / 3) (#9)
by Steve M on Thu Oct 16, 2008 at 01:01:37 AM EST

Supporting redistribution because it's good for everybody is quite different from supporting redistribution "for its own sake."
As Obama patiently explained to Joe the plumber, Joe's business does a lot better when his customers have enough money to hire him.

: i probably have. what can i (none / 0) (#12)
by cpinva on Thu Oct 16, 2008 at 02:34:36 PM EST

say, it's low-hanging fruit! :)

I'm pretty sure you've used that simple-minded ad hom about my nick before, or at least many others have.
frankly, based on econ 101, sen. obama is correct:

"When you spread the wealth around, it's good for everybody".
far better for the economy, than having wealth concentrated in the hands of a few. but that has nothing to do with his tax plan. those with the most, tend to benefit the most from the commonweal.
it certainly is a capitalist idea that they should be required to pay more to support the infrastructure, that provides them the means to get and maintain their wealth.

Joe Six Pack's brother-in-law (none / 0) (#10)
by SwingVoter on Thu Oct 16, 2008 at 02:19:09 AM EST

The Top 50 Swing Voters: #27 - Joe The Plumber

#50 - Hockey Moms - Demographic Power Play
#47 - People with STDs - Burning for Change
#40 - Anonymous Sperm Donors - Swimming Against The Tide
#36 - Master Debaters - Everybody's Doing It
#29 - Nudists - Sticking To The Issues

Just the Facts, Ma'am (none / 0) (#13)
by UnaffiliatedIndie on Sat Oct 18, 2008 at 01:32:18 AM EST

Forget the character attacks, however deserved or not. Let's deal with the actual issue that was raised. Here's a relevant excerpt from the conservative Wall Street Journal's article of OCTOBER 17, 2008, 'As Joe the Plumber Grows Famous, the Politics Get Murkier':

"To reach a level that would be affected by Sen. Obama's proposed tax increase, Mr. Smither said, a mom-and-pop plumbing company like Newell would have to clear $5 million in annual sales. [Joe's company actually reports only $100,000 in sales.]

Even if Mr. Wurzelbacher reaped taxable income from his business of $280,000 a
year, he'd pay only about $900 more a year in taxes under Sen. Obama's plan, which
would raise the tax rate on the income between $250,000 and $280,000 to 36%
from 33%.

[...]

If Mr. Wurzelbacher earns the wages of a typical Ohio plumber, $40,600, and holds a $90,000 mortgage, he would see a TAX CUT (emphasis added) under Sen. Obama's plan of more than $1,000, compared with no tax reduction under Sen. McCain's.

If he succeeds in buying the plumbing business where he works, he could see even more tax benefits, including Sen. Obama's proposed elimination of capital-gains taxes for small-business investment, a 50% tax credit to purchase health insurance for employees and a $3,000 tax credit for every new hire over the next two years."

Other issues and `things we wish were true' aside, better to acknowledge facts and deal with them objectively.