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By TChris, Section Blog Related
Posted on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 11:50:12 AM EST
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by TChris

The TalkLeft writers are working or playing or hanging out in Amsterdam. Here's a place to chat about the week's events.

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    Open Thread | 43 comments (43 topical)
    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#2)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 01:08:01 PM EST
    Mike - Good luck!

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#3)
    by glanton on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 01:13:52 PM EST
    Here's something funny. Brit Hume, that walking waste of oxegen, has posted for one of his recent "Grapevines" a satire of some Muslim bakers changing the word "Danish" to "pastry." We all know why they have done this, and we know that it's ridiculous. But coming from Hume or anyone at Fox, what nerve to make fun of it even as they throw such sympathy on American ignoramuses coining "Freedom Fries," "Freedom Toast," and the despicable like. The rhetorics are mirror images, my friends. Mirror images.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#4)
    by roy on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 01:18:43 PM EST
    I lost two of my cousins in the French Fry protest riots.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#5)
    by glanton on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 01:21:54 PM EST
    Roy, that's pretty good. Touche. But note I said the "rhetorics" were mirror images. Not the actions. Still, words and rhetorical strategies are funny things. Don't be so quick to misuderestimate them.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#6)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 01:24:30 PM EST
    I'm looking for guest posters over at The Quail Hunter. Just register and post.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#7)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 01:36:01 PM EST
    Meanwhile on "The Religion of Peace Front..
    Thousands of rioters burned 15 churches in Maiduguri in a three-hour rampage before troops and police reinforcements restored order, Nigerian police spokesman Haz Iwendi said. Iwendi said security forces arrested dozens of people in the city about 1,000 miles northeast of the capital, Lagos. Chima Ezeoke, a Christian Maiduguri resident, said protesters attacked and looted shops owned by minority Christians, most of them with origins in the country's south. "Most of the dead were Christians beaten to death on the streets by the rioters," Ezeoke said. Witnesses said three children and a priest were among those killed.
    Yes sir, there is nothing like a riot, beating and killing, especially priests and children to make a terrorist's day. Oh well, we all know they are just misunderstood. Probably still pis*ed off about the Crusades.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#8)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 01:41:02 PM EST
    Our land High on the moors, We chance upon grouse butts, Mock childhood dens, Where men of power Can hide from small creatures And play grown up games With big guns. And, like a dog I piss in every one, Spray my contempt On those who take pleasure In killing wild beauty And restake a claim For our land. Colin Watts.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#9)
    by cpinva on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 02:04:25 PM EST
    mike, wouldn't it just be a whole lot easier to pass an amendment banning james dobson? i think that's a concept that a fair % of the population could get behind!

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#10)
    by MikeDitto on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 03:29:17 PM EST
    CP: ROFL. Thanks Jim! Be sure to toss a few shekels our way once I get through the process of signing up with the credit card company (It's worse than buying a house!).

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#11)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 04:43:13 PM EST
    Mike - Will do. glanton - Come on, you can't disconnect the riots from the rhetoric. The former would not exist without the latter.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#12)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 05:29:20 PM EST
    Mike D - Your link isn't working.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#13)
    by Che's Lounge on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 05:43:56 PM EST
    Jim, Glanton didn't disconnect them. He just pointed out that rhetoric can be just as dangerous as actions because it leads to actions. Nice try, though.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#14)
    by Che's Lounge on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 05:45:56 PM EST
    IMHO Glanton. I do not presume to be your interpreter.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#15)
    by glanton on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 05:47:50 PM EST
    Here's a question for you, Jim: Why is replacing "Danish" with "Sweet pastry" silly, but replacing "French Fries" with "Freedom Fries" patriotic? If you cannot recognize that the two are equally ridiculous--if you cannot recognize that it is hypocritical to laugh off one but indulge the other, then really, I'm sorry. Mediocrity bites.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#16)
    by glanton on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 05:50:31 PM EST
    Che, That's pretty much what I was getting at. That, and to stress the comedic, almost Faustian element of looking at the enemy and seeing way more of yourself than you could ever admit. Peace.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#17)
    by jimakaPPJ on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 06:45:02 PM EST
    glanton - The problem is that the riots and killings are real. The priest was real. The children were real. Do you find that funny? I don't think you do. Can you imagine the horror of the childen. glanton, the right often calls the Left "elitist" and snears at their sophistry. I hate to say this, but your inability to connect the riots with their Imamas calls for riots proves their point. A civilization that will not defend itself will not remain a civilization. The Imams see that, and they have no doubt that they can make us do what they want. First the free press goes, and then the calls for prayers in which, a first, you only have to stand respectfully, comes. Then the demand that we all bow to the East. After all it is just respect. Che - The facts are that the west is not rioting and killing. You should quit worrying about Freedom Fries and Pat Robertson and start worrying about who we are losing our freedom to.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#18)
    by roy on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 06:54:52 PM EST
    Jim, Your point about the Left's percieved elitism would be stronger if we didn't start the topic with an example from the Right making light of the situation. The Left and Right are elitist. The minor parties probably are too, they're just too overlooked for it to show. Maybe you have to be elitist to feel justified in putting your agenda into the government.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#19)
    by glanton on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 07:42:02 PM EST
    Jim, I realize I;m wasting my breath with you since you usually ignore my point entirely, or don't respond at all when you've been beaten, or go ad hominem. But then, it's fun shredding your affectation of patriotic honor and your severely flawed logic. So wheeee! Here we go yet again. This is not the first, nor will it be the last time, that you have used the "elitism" schtick against me. Which is fine because I cheerfully accept the mantle as defined by the likes of you and Rush Limbaugh. To the extent elitism means recognizing mass hypocrisy (media and populace), then elitism is for me. To the extent elitism means recognizing that the Confederate flag is a marker of an ignorant redneck racist, then elitism is for me. Etc. As for your attempt to shame me for pointing out the comedic nature of the spectacle, hey, don't shoot the messenger. When United States Congressmen take special time out of their day to change the menu to read "Freedom Fries," that's funny. Whenever I see some idiot with a Boycott France bumper sticker, that's comedic too. All this outrage misdirected, when there could be real attention focused on real problems with our own government, our own society. The Muslims rioting over cartoons are no better than ignorant savages. But, when they insist that the "Danish" be changed to the "Sweet Pastry," they too become comedic. And before you get too offended by the word "comedic," get away from your Fox News Proscribed REading List and read one or two of Shakespeare's comedies. They are often brutal, comedy is often brutal. And if it only an elitist who can understand and secondsay such things, then elitism is for me. Stay alert, and stay with Fox.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#20)
    by Che's Lounge on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 07:45:07 PM EST
    The facts are that the west is not rioting and killing. Not rioting, but certainly doing our fair share of killing. Tell me Jim. What is the difference between the US bombing a house and killing innocents, and the deaths from these riots? People die either way. Give up? A: Bush bombs in our name. Suddenly you show compassion and outrage. But not for the victims of your own government's war machine. How transparent. You should quit worrying about Freedom Fries and Pat Robertson and start worrying about who we are losing our freedom to. That wasn't me, but I know perfectly well to whom we are losing our freedom. And it is NOT Osama Bin Laden, or Saddam Hussein.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#21)
    by Che's Lounge on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 07:48:29 PM EST
    Glanton, Robert Heinlien wrote in "Stranger in a Strange Land" that all humor is derived from someone's suffering.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#22)
    by Che's Lounge on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 07:50:45 PM EST
    You elitist pig. (JM, that's a joke!)

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#23)
    by squeaky on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 09:30:55 PM EST
    Looks like terror attacks worldwide are finally down. Down that is, in a world where down is always up. The Bush Administration speaks. via firedoglake

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#24)
    by Johnny on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 09:40:28 PM EST
    Huh... Experts puzzled by the rapid spread of bird flu... My $.02? Disease spreads more rapidly in a world based on international commerce and high density population areas. The fact that the experts are surprised is a mystery to me. (Jim, you should change your sentence above to read "all civilizations that do not successfully defend themselves... again, just my $.02)

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#1)
    by MikeDitto on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 10:35:16 PM EST
    If y'all've (ooh, two apostrophes!) been wondering where I've been, look no farther than here. I'm webmastering (and software developing, and blogging, and doing all the IT stuff) for Coloradans for Fairness and Equality. We're advocating for the passage of domestic partnership benefits in Colorado, and against the passage of James Dobson's marriage ban. Do check us out. And if you're in the area, we're having an open house on March 1.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#25)
    by MikeDitto on Sun Feb 19, 2006 at 10:36:29 PM EST
    Thanks Jim, I fixed it. Me no spel r writ 2 gud.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#26)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Feb 20, 2006 at 04:48:47 AM EST
    Interesting article on the politics of personal destruction and what it is doing to all of us.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#27)
    by Slado on Mon Feb 20, 2006 at 07:31:15 AM EST
    This was an amazing article... 40% 40% of the UK's Muslims want Shria law applied inside Great Britian. These are muslims who have the freedoms of western society and all it's advantages and 40% of them still want to trend backwards. So if this is possible in GB what do the people who actualy live in the Middle East and don't get exposed to western society think? I found this amazing.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#28)
    by jimakaPPJ on Mon Feb 20, 2006 at 07:50:07 AM EST
    Glanton - The deal is simple. The Left will laugh at "Freedom Fries" but will not laugh, or condemn, the comments and actions of the Imams that triggered the riots over the cartoons, and the deaths. The reasons given are varied, but usually are given as "respect" for the radical Moslems' point of view, coupled with an attack against western culture and/or the US. Diversity is the buzz word. But the extreme of diversity is balkanization. All of the groups that have come into the country have had to have their rough edges knocked off. Many of the religious groups have also had to change and conform. I have not seen a single US Imam condemn the actions of that Imam calling for riots. Why not? Johnny - Agreed. Slado - Exactly. Che - One is the result of a war, triggered by the actions of radical Moslems. And forget about the "no WMDs, no terrorists in Iraq" argumnet. Thde cause was the long series of terrorists attacks, icluding the attacks of 9/11. Without these there would have been no invasion based upon 9/11 alone. The riots are the result of radical Moslem religious leaders spewing hate and the death of the Jews, the west, etc. BTW - These actions caused both the attacks over the years as well as the current riots. Without them, none of these deaths would have occurred. They are the cancer.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#29)
    by Che's Lounge on Mon Feb 20, 2006 at 09:14:08 AM EST
    One is the result of a war, triggered by the actions of radical Moslems. That's factually incorrect, or haven't you been reading the news for the last three years? The war in Irag was "triggered" by revenge. And forget about the "no WMDs, no terrorists in Iraq" argumnet. Yes just close your eyes and the lies go away. Must be nice.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#30)
    by MikeDitto on Mon Feb 20, 2006 at 11:25:52 AM EST
    For whatever reason this page failed to rebuild after the last comment, so it was coming up blank. I forced a rebuild, so looks OK now.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#31)
    by Edger on Mon Feb 20, 2006 at 11:28:31 AM EST
    Happened a few times to me over the weekend too, and a couple of times today, Mike.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#32)
    by glanton on Mon Feb 20, 2006 at 12:13:40 PM EST
    Jim, Your response to me demonstrates as well as anything you have recently written, the problems you and I have communicating with one another. You write:
    The Left will laugh at "Freedom Fries" but will not laugh, or condemn, the comments and actions of the Imams that triggered the riots over the cartoons, and the deaths.
    And this with full knowledge that in my posts on this and other threads, I have indeed condemned the rioters. In short, thou hyperbolic pretender to the throne of 'my country right or wrong,' you forget the most important rule of communication: When you respond to me, you are not responding to "The Left," but to a person who has eschewed Talking Points as much as possible and is trying to make a broader point. A flesh and blood human being, in other words. But time and again you show yourself incapable of rapporting in this manner. My point stands. The "Freedom Fries" and the "Boycott France" contingent in this nation is not to be conceived as patriotic or honorable, even in terms of intent, but rather to be laughed at, scorned, and otherwise written off by anyone with half a brain. Even if those with half a brain are considered elitists because they are in the minority. As for the "Danish" people, it's the same, these people, like the rioters who protest the cartoons through violence, deserve no respect. And of course, one wonders whehere they picked up on this particular rhetorical device? After watching for years as we sugarcoat travesties with words like "Patriot Act" and "Freedom," they have learned that you can fight a war sometimes without dropping a bomb, but through euphemism, through deceit, and through the ignorance of the masses. You, Jim, sympathize with and defend the ingorant American masses. Good luck with that. Che writes:
    I know perfectly well to whom we are losing our freedom. And it is NOT Osama Bin Laden, or Saddam Hussein.
    Very good, my friend. Fresh air in a thread putrified by Spread-Eagle Patriotic blither-blather. Clearly you are neither staying alert, nor staying with Fox.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#33)
    by glanton on Mon Feb 20, 2006 at 12:58:07 PM EST
    To clarify, when I said "Danish" people, I was trusting everyone to understand that I mean those who insist of replacing "Danish" with something like "Sweet Pastry." I was not referring to the Danish cartoonists, who I consider to have behaved honorably. I was trusting people to understand this, but then I remembered that my point was directed at Jim, who without fail would rather twist someone's point that address it straight up.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#34)
    by jimakaPPJ on Mon Feb 20, 2006 at 01:32:19 PM EST
    Glanton - If I write to you that the NY Yankees will win the world series next year, does that mean that I think you are a Yankees fan, and in anyway responsible for them? So my point remains: " The Left." That is "in general," and I think it is accurate. If you disagree with their position, fine. If not, fine. My disagreement with you was your stated position.
    But note I said the "rhetorics" were mirror images. Not the actions.
    I responded with quotes and a link of rioting in Niger in which people were killed and wrote:
    glanton - Come on, you can't disconnect the riots from the rhetoric. The former would not exist without the latter.
    You responded with:
    Why is replacing "Danish" with "Sweet pastry" silly, but replacing "French Fries" with "Freedom Fries" patriotic? If you cannot recognize that the two are equally ridiculous--if you cannot recognize that it is hypocritical to laugh off one but indulge the other, then really, I'm sorry.
    Now the fact that I never said they were not silly appears to have escaped your notice. My point was the reality of the riots caused by the Imam's rhetoric, not the silliness of Sweet Pastries and Freedom Fries.
    The problem is that the riots and killing is real. The priest was real. The children were real. Do you find that funny? I don't think you do.
    And note that I say that I don't think you think the deaths funny. But I do think, based on your comments:
    glanton, the right often calls the Left "elitist" and sneers at their sophistry. I hate to say this, but your inability to connect the riots with their Imams' calls for riots proves their point.
    Now. Right there I say that you are a member of the Left, and that your inability to focus on these riots rather than comparing Freedom Fries to Sweet Pastries demonstrates the sophistry that the Right sneers at. That is: "subtly deceptive reasoning or argumentation" Why? Because there were no riots in America associated with calls for Freedom Fries. No priest was killed. No children were killed. So why link the two acts? They both may have been silly, but they were not the same. Now you finally do make a concession to the fact that these people are savages.
    The Muslims rioting over cartoons are no better than ignorant savages.
    Here again we get the sophistry. The rioters are condemned, and the demands for Sweet Pastries" are deemed "comedic." But not one word condemning the Imams for their actions. And you can't quite resist making a little elitist dig about FNC and watching same. Well, you know, there just aint enough T&A on PBS for us Bubbas in the Red States... Guess I better get me a chew and PBR. And when I again noted the lack of condemnation of the Imams and the rioters you finally issue your ultimate insult.
    You, Jim, sympathize with and defend the ingorant American masses. Good luck with that.
    Defend? I don't need to do that. They have defended themselves and the rest of the world from tyranny for the last hundred years. Ignorant? I don't think so. They have created a culture that is the envy of the world and an economic machine that provides riches beyond the dreams of our ancestors and freedoms unknown to mankind. God, I wish we had more people in the world exactly like them.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#35)
    by glanton on Mon Feb 20, 2006 at 01:48:48 PM EST
    Here again we get the sophistry. The rioters are condemned, and the demands for Sweet Pastries" are deemed "comedic." But not one word condemning the Imams for their actions.
    I don't know how much more clear I could possibly be on this. As far as I am concerend, the lot of them, Imama, ignorant mass rioters, and pastry chefs alike are sickening caricatures of what a real human being could be.
    And you can't quite resist making a little elitist dig about FNC and watching same. Well, you know, there just aint enough T&A on PBS for us Bubbas in the Red States... Guess I better get me a chew and PBR.
    Yes, perhaps you'd better. Or, you could recognize cheap tabloid propaganda for what it is. But undopubtedly, the PBR is the easier route, and thus the intrinsic appeal of it amongst the "Bubbas."
    They have defended themselves and the rest of the world from tyranny for the last hundred years.
    Ahh, the good ole GRAND NARRATIVE of American always with the white hat. Such a narrative ignores, for example, the extent to which Hitler had the Americans (media and government) fooled, just as much as the Belgians and French were, until things had gotten way out of hand and then several countries pulled together and fought off the Axis. Or perhaps you consider WWI a 'struggle against tyranny'? Yeah, I guess that's easier than admitting that it was a clusterf%#k on all sides for which germany was forced to take the blame. And on and on. American foreign policy has been the same as every other great Empire, it has existed for its own economic furtherance. So stuff the ideological tripe. This isn't ninth grade civics class nor is it the RNC nor the DNC nor, for that matter, "The Big Story" with John "Boycott France" Gibson. As for the cultural paragon tripe, well I can only say this: America has produced more than its fair share of great art and science, agreed. But socially we remain retarded. We still do not consider women autonomous beings nor homosexuals, for example: there are plent ot Western European nations whose average citizens clean our clock in terms of literacy, multi-lingualism, ability to accept difference, and taste in beer. One could argue that if only they would drop soccer and pick up baseball they would be perfect, culturally (a joke but not without w whiff of truth). RE your exaltation of the "economic machine," boy you got that right. A machine that rolls over every other culture and thoroughly compartmentalizes its own citizens but leaves them to die if they get sick and cannot pay their way, or if they fall through the cracks in any other way. In sum, like it or not, Jim, we got more problems in this country than we know what to do with. Instead, then, of going to the cafeteria to demand "Freedom Fries" and instead of "Boycotting France," instead of lying us into wars with soveriegn nations, instead of a helluva lot of things, it would be a mark of character is the American masses would stand up and yell "Stop!" to their bosses. "Stop and let's fix this mess, let's remain a free country." When they do that I will respect them. Sorry, but the fact that they don't blow things up like Muslim radicals is a start, but it isn't enough.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#36)
    by jimakaPPJ on Mon Feb 20, 2006 at 02:52:46 PM EST
    I don't know how much more clear I could possibly be
    Well, you could have made that point earlier. And you might try and recognizing at bit of sarcasm. I mean chewing is out... And everybody I know drinks Bud Lite with their lunch down at the Palatial Retirement Compound,, Catfish Pond and BBQ Stand. The basic difference between us appears to be in attitude. I think the glass is half full and getting fuller. You see it as half empty and getting emptier. I recognize our problems but think they are being solved. You do not. We fought WWII with greater problems. The question now is if we can fight what is essentially a war between two different cultures with about 25% of the country apparently unwilling to help. Your closing comments are telling:
    Sorry, but the fact that they don't blow things up like Muslim radicals is a start, but it isn't enough. So you will condemn both, even though the former is capable of peaceful change and the latter absolutely is not. That's called "trying to have your cake and eating it too." Doesn't work in most cases.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#37)
    by jimakaPPJ on Mon Feb 20, 2006 at 02:55:13 PM EST
    et al - Obviously the last two paragraphs are not quotes from galnton. Heaven only knows why they are shown so.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#38)
    by jondee on Mon Feb 20, 2006 at 03:20:12 PM EST
    The rioting is just about cartoons - another FNC dumb down for the masses. Jim, you dont want reality; you want a bedtime story.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#40)
    by glanton on Mon Feb 20, 2006 at 05:25:18 PM EST
    p.s. Please, keep calling me an "elitist." Coming from you and Rush, I wear the charge as a true badge of honor.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#41)
    by jimakaPPJ on Mon Feb 20, 2006 at 07:21:35 PM EST
    jondee - It is difficult sometimes for me to understand that if everything isn't spelled out for you, then you tend to get off track. So let me break it down. No, the cartoons are not causing the riots. The religious "leaders" are causing the riots. Why do you think I keep coming back to them? glanton - After thinking about it, I am convinced that you are not elite. Your opinion in this matter is probably different. As for Rush, I didn't know you listened? Since I don't, perhaps you can tell us what his latest theme is.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#42)
    by Edger on Mon Feb 20, 2006 at 07:58:43 PM EST
    Anybody up to explaining again how we're "winning hearts and minds", and of course winning(?) the war in Iraq and delivering "freedom and democracy" to Iraqis. Bring it on boys...
    Iraqi Province Cuts Off U.S. Forces February 20, 2006, 2:30 PM EST KARBALA, Iraq -- The governing council of Karbala province said Monday it was suspending contact with U.S. forces over the behavior of soldiers during a visit to the governor's office two days ago. The decision followed similar moves by leaders of Maysan and Basra provinces, which have frozen ties with British forces in southern Iraq. Karbala provincial spokesman Abdel Amir Hanoun complained that U.S. soldiers brought dogs inside the building when their commander visited provincial Gov. Aqeel al-Khazraji, considered an insult by the council. They also blocked roads leading to the governor's office, preventing council members and the governor from parking cars outside the building, Hanoun said. The governor instructed the council to suspend contacts until U.S. forces apologize, he said. ... On Sunday, Maysan province decided to suspend ties with British authorities pending an investigation into a recently released videotape of British soldiers beating Iraqi youths during a January 2004 riot there.
    Mission Accomplished?

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#43)
    by glanton on Mon Feb 20, 2006 at 08:04:47 PM EST
    I never said I was elite. The term "elitist," as you know, has been a favorite toy of the Rethugs for quite some time. It's their spin machine's clever way of ingratiating Red(neck) America's anti-intellectualism, by reinforcing notions like: if you read difficult books or attempt to negotiate difficult concepts, you "just think you're better than everybody else." What I have been doing is simply demonstrating how easy it is to undercut that rhetorical "strategy", for the benefit (not to mention the amusement) of anyone who has been dismissed as "elitist" whenever they call out bigotry for what it is. Thanks for springboarding the lesson. Next week, we'll work on the many ways to defeat the trie term "flip-flopper" when some ignoramus throws it out there. Until then, boycott France, stay alert, and stay with Fox. p.s. It's okay if you haven't listened to Rush in a while. It's the same garbage circulating all over your favorite News Sources and websites.

    Re: Open Thread (none / 0) (#44)
    by Talkleft Visitor on Mon Feb 20, 2006 at 09:51:53 PM EST
    But, if you want to really pin that on someone, try the FISA judges that are appointed for life... Are you sure you aren't confusing the FISA court with the Supreme Court? How about a quote from the section of code dealing with the FISA court:
    (d) Tenure Each judge designated under this section shall so serve for a maximum of seven years and shall not be eligible for redesignation, except that the judges first designated under subsection (a) of this section shall be designated for terms of from one to seven years so that one term expires each year, and that judges first designated under subsection (b) of this section shall be designated for terms of three, five, and seven years.
    Link Google search on US Code Title 50 Chapter 36

    Open Thread | 43 comments (43 topical)